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Re: Hampshire Day 4
Posted by: Clarence Parker (IP Logged)
Date: 14 May, 2018 18:29

It is not in me to gloat about something that I hold very dear, but spending a day yesterday watching the run fest led me to think that sadly today could be yet another repeat. It had 'drawn game' written all over it yesterday afternoon, and so it transpired.

I am sure that we gave 100%, I am sure that Hants' batters were as good as ours were yesterday, but the 8 - day old pitch killed the game.

"Taunton is killing cricket" - now where have I heard that before?

Final word from me on this game.

Re: Hampshire Day 4
Posted by: Tom Seymour (IP Logged)
Date: 14 May, 2018 18:42

"Police jockeys", I have heard it all now, but thanks for the photos Mike.

As someone said earlier, when you resort to dead pitches like this you need either someone of sheer pace, or perhaps a wrist spinner when your regular spinners can't get much help from it.

Our attack does well at times on helpful pitches, but has too much sameness about it without much variety.

Still we didn't lose and are better placed in the Championship than we were last year, but looking at the fixture list, where is the next win coming from. I want to see results, not boring draws.

A glass half - empty or a glass half - full?
Regardless, both glasses need filling up.

Re: Hampshire Day 4
Posted by: wsm fan (IP Logged)
Date: 14 May, 2018 19:06

Sheer pace?
If only we had someone who can bowl 90mph at will fully fit and just ready to return!
I've been saying for months how crucial Jamie is to our red ball team.
The bowling group have been superb this season and got the 2 wins in April with little fuss.
But up at Lancs and then this game we were crying out for Jamie as an option.
He isnt always our most economical bowler but i couldnt give a stuff, we have others to do that role. 20-0-100-3 we would have won this game

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 14/05/2018 19:07 by wsm fan.

Re: Hampshire Day 4
Posted by: Shepton Paul 2 (IP Logged)
Date: 14 May, 2018 19:23

Back to Ciderabad, or at least a nearby suburb, please.

Re: Hampshire Day 4
Posted by: AGod (IP Logged)
Date: 14 May, 2018 19:28

Quite right, SP.

Re: Hampshire Day 4
Posted by: AGod (IP Logged)
Date: 14 May, 2018 19:29

Sorry, WSM, but 20-0-100-3, would still have left us 3 wickets short (and with more runs to chase) - and that's assuming that Jamie played instead of somebody who went wicketless in the innings. If, for example, Jamie had played instead of TG, then we'd be not three wickets short, but five short (as TG took 2 wkts anyway, so we would gain only 1 net wkt on those figures of 20-0-100-3 that you've given to Jamie)

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 14/05/2018 19:31 by AGod.

Re: Hampshire Day 4
Posted by: wsm fan (IP Logged)
Date: 14 May, 2018 19:34

Not if it had come by lunchtime today as if we'd got Vince under 100 & into 7/8/9 by lunch it would have been all over in plenty of time to chase any target.

Anyway Surrey Middlesex or Sussex will be his first victims now.....

Re: Hampshire Day 4
Posted by: Tom Seymour (IP Logged)
Date: 14 May, 2018 19:57

WSM, where have you been?

Jamie Overton made his Somerset debut in 2012, which makes this his 7th season with the club. During that time he has appeared in 44 Championship matches (6 per season) and taken 98 wickets. These have come at a cost of 36 runs apiece and include just 2 Fifers.

You see great potential still to come. My hopes of that dissipated a while ago. When I was last at the County Ground a member said to me that he may well have to give up the game sooner rather than later. I don’t wish that on him, but patience can only be tolerated for a given period of time.

Will 2018 be his breakthrough year? I don’t think so, but you clearly do and there we must agree to differ.

As a club we need to still keep looking, not just pinning our hopes on one individual.

A glass half - empty or a glass half - full?
Regardless, both glasses need filling up.

Re: Hampshire Day 4
Posted by: AGod (IP Logged)
Date: 14 May, 2018 20:05

Well, everyone's looking Tom (for express bowlers that can bowl straight, that is) among the counties.

Re: Hampshire Day 4
Posted by: wsm fan (IP Logged)
Date: 14 May, 2018 20:09

Well a new contract signed last August until 2020 presumably slightly above minimum wage! suggests the club also think he has something to offer.

As knowledgable as i am (and yourself too clearly) maybe just maybe those employeeing him know more than us both put together. Unless of course you have the coaching qualifications & experience needed to run a county cricket club?

As to having to give up the game soon, seriously where do you get this rubbish. I took the opportunity to say hello to him on Friday lunchtime (as i suggested you did) and he said fully fit & it was coming out well. He is desperate to get back on the pitch & contribute to the team.

As you say we very much differ on our views here so lets see how the next few weeks/months go and whose more accurate on our predictions.....

Re: Hampshire Day 4
Posted by: Grizzers (IP Logged)
Date: 14 May, 2018 20:14

Whether extreme pace would have made any difference is debatable.

Fidel Edwards for Hants was steaming in yesterday to very little effect. I watched a few overs of his from the viewing area below the Press Box & he looked pretty lively !

I've no idea how much faster Jove would/could be ?


Re: Hampshire Day 4
Posted by: Hants01 (IP Logged)
Date: 14 May, 2018 20:14

This was a fixture Hampshire won last season and it's a measure of the struggles that we didn't look remotely like doing likewise this time. The injuries are mounting: Northeast, Crane, Dawson and now Abbott. I have never bought this hard luck story: good teams, as they say, make their own luck.

For once, Hampshire's feeble batting held firm. I suppose every dog has its day- no thanks to the openers' for their dismal dismissals. The pitch allied to some rare resolution conspired to snuff out Somerset.

I suspect Vince is safe for the First Test- some aren't so sure- but someone who can't average more than 30 in Division 1, is unlikely to average 40 in Test cricket.

Even with an embyonic table, it has an ominous look about it: Hants and Worcestershire propping it up.

Somerset can head into the Royal London Cup in good shape and spirits. (The RLC should be played on the Bank Holiday weekends with counties playing two fixtures each on them. The rest on other weekends.)

Re: Hampshire Day 4
Posted by: Grockle (IP Logged)
Date: 14 May, 2018 21:02

It's great that we have these bunches of 'members' we meet at the ground with seemingly fundamental expertise about the future of fast bowlers there to act as expert witnesses and willing to solve all our problems by just telling us what the solution is during a chat.

And there you were Tom to report it to us in your usual ( it seems) 'objective' way.


Re: Hampshire Day 4
Posted by: AGod (IP Logged)
Date: 14 May, 2018 21:19

I think, Grizzly, the answer is that Jamie cannot really bowl any quicker than Fidel Edwards. Of course, he's a different style of bowler though (high, over the top action from a tall man, vs skiddy/slingy action of Fidel).

I think the answer is that high pace, in and of itself, would not have been enough on this pudding of a pitch. To win on that, a team would need at least one world-class pace bowler and, very possibly, a world-class wrist-spinner to boot. If we'd had Joel Garner and Mushtaq, each at their best, there's every chance that we would have won. The only bowler currently on the county circuit (albeit yet to debut) that I think may have made a difference would have been Morne Morkel. Guys like him or his erstwhile teammate, Kagiso Rabada, or of course Dale Steyn at his best... to overcome a pitch like that you need both high speed AND very high skill level.

The vast majority of English pitches conspire against genuinely quick bowlers. North Marine Road (Scarborough) is one that often suits them. And Old Trafford certainly used to, but less so these days. Beyond that, it's slim pickings, it really is.

Re: Hampshire Day 4
Posted by: That Bloke With The Dog (IP Logged)
Date: 14 May, 2018 21:50

Pitches have gone the same way all over the world. Fidel Edwards' Test debut was on a lightning surface at Sabina Park, where he took a five-for, with the W Indies crushing Sri Lanka. Unfortunately for Edwards, nobody in Jamaica could be bothered to preserve pitches like that, and his international career fell away (along with the W Indies as a force to be feared).

It's one reason I've loved watching Fiddy over the weekend, even on this dying wicket at Taunton: he's one of the last, tenuous links with a lost world. Brian Lara was his captain for that debut in Jamaica, with Chris Gayle opening the batting. In retrospect it turned out to be just about the very last sight of those great, exciting W Indies teams.

There was just a glimpse of that magic in his first over from the River End. Nothing had been happening for him from the Church End, and he'd been mooching around on the long leg boundary looking thoroughly miserable. Then suddenly there was that unplayable rocket to dismiss Byrom, the trademark "you-didn't-even-see-that-one" celebration, and an over of fire and ferocity. Great stuff.

Re: Hampshire Day 4
Posted by: Tom Seymour (IP Logged)
Date: 14 May, 2018 22:17

Well yes Grockle, when you attend the ground and do not have to rely on watching a streaming service from millions of miles away, you get the opportunity to discuss what is going on with other members.

Said member was expressing his opinion based on Overton, J's poor record of fitness as well you understand. In that the club cannot go on retaining the services of such an absentee ad nauseum, he should have to accept that his body is simply not up to the demands of a professional cricketer. Contract, or no contract, such a fate has befallen others in the past and it will again.

That should be easy enough for anyone to understand.

EDIT Removal of pointless quote from post two above. Please use the quote facility only if the post is on a different page or you want to selectively refer to a part of a quote from another poster. Just repeating the post in quotes simply increase the size of a thread and makes longer threads more difficult for mobile users to access.

A glass half - empty or a glass half - full?
Regardless, both glasses need filling up.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 15/05/2018 03:41 by Grockle.

Re: Hampshire Day 4
Posted by: Scrumper (IP Logged)
Date: 14 May, 2018 23:25

It was such a sad sight yesterday watching Jamie going around the ground in his wheelchair, I really hope he's at least able to walk properly soon.

Re: Hampshire Day 4
Posted by: Grockle (IP Logged)
Date: 15 May, 2018 04:41


As the topic was about the 'objectivity' of reports about a player who, please correct me if I'm wrong. hasn't bowled a ball in anger in a game at Taunton during this season, I am wondering how my location has anything to do with it.

Most of us take your point about Jamie's injury record (though we may post it in less aggressive tones rather than as if it was the player's fault) and again, I am not sure what a Botham Stand supporting resident has relating to the long term issue (due to their attendance at games in 2018) that anyone else would not have. We are all a 'million miles... away' from it if we don't have facts.

But you go further than that and give us the member's assessment of the present situation 'body not up to the demands of professional cricket' as if that's it and the solution is get rid of Jamie Overton.

That's not 'objective'. That is a subjective opinion by a person I assume is NOT an expert on the 'demands of professional cricket' or what Jamie's body is 'up to' and who does not have access to any more information than the rest, present or virtual.

I have been away a while but I doubt the club have set up a 'medical expert think tank' in the Botham Stand and given membership to people capable of having professional opinions on the situation while I've been away.

So the 'I've had a chat with a member and the solution is.....' stance is not objective posting.

We all talk in this virtual Taunton. We have had our virtual experience enhanced this year by some visuals but that does not provide off field info (can't even see the boundary). However we can talk to people on the boundary and get their subjective input and we can all get facts that offer objective slants to the subject matter. So your 'you're not here so you don't know' view is less and less valid year by year and irrelevant to this present issue.

And as far as I am aware there is nowhere in the supporting sections of the County Ground where the 'font of all knowledge' has been set up and I am damn sure it is not within 20 feet of where you watch from Thomas.

Please post your opinions and that of others but don't spout how you always post 'objectively' and then give us this guff. It's a personal opinion of someone you talked to and unless you can relate it to observable and verifiable fact that is all it is.

As far as I know, Jamie is bowling, as far as I know he is being considered for a comeback during the one day games, as far as I know he is fit. I think some of that can be verified from sources in the know but I can't be sure so it is still my assessment and nothing more than that.

See how it is done?

You are right when you say it should be easy for anyone to understand.

Why don't you seem to understand it then?

This isn't the first time we have had this conversation and the difference between 'subjectivity and'objectivity' still seems to elude you.

Ahh well 'you can take the horse to water but you can't...' (Sm11)


Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 15/05/2018 05:32 by Grockle.

Re: Hampshire Day 4
Posted by: AGod (IP Logged)
Date: 15 May, 2018 06:00

Bloke with Dog - I agree completely about Fidel - I really enjoyed watching him perform.

Gibson gave out the stat (given to him by somebody else), that Fidel has a career CC strike rate of 36, which is incredible, and the best figure for any bowler this century in the CC... and even somebody with that record managed a grand total of two wickets.... which tells you most of what you need to know about that surface...

Re: Hampshire Day 4
Posted by: Ronniesabre (IP Logged)
Date: 15 May, 2018 07:31

Attended all 4 days in good weather . Met some good people and some good cricket too.

Some thoughts.

1 . We gave up the ghost at 3.30 when Byrom came on . I get why we did that as we probably didn’t want to over bowl the bowlers this early in season and wicket was dead. So Kerr saying boys have given everything is only true to a point .

2. Last hour will drive people away from the game . Bartlett’ s 2 Beamers say it all . Hurry etc need to look at that type of wicket as I think we need to win 2 more home games and 3 away to have a realistic chance. Did anyone think that Bartlett actually got Vince out caught by abell but it was a no ball ? Or was it bump ball . Thought by Bartlett’s reaction it was a catch.

3. Some here know the wicket and predicted a draw. Well done to them . Others? well........

Overall a good start but we need freshened up and trego myburgh vdm etc will give us that at the weekend!!! Hopefully we keep good run going.

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